Brand Name Selection
Closed this issue · 458 comments
We need a new brand name for the set of specifications that will be created by the new community process. This brand name will also become a certification mark in the industry for compatible, independent implementations. The open source projects that fall under the Eclipse EE4J top level project will be one such implementation. In short, we need a new name to replace “Java EE”. Much like the OpenJDK project implements the Java SE Platform specification, the EE4J projects will provide implementations of a set of specifications that we today call Java EE: we need a brand name for this set of specifications.
With this in mind, we are initiating a community process to select the brand name. This process will be managed by the EE4J Project Management Committee (“PMC”) with assistance from the Eclipse Management Organization (“EMO”). The name that is selected by this process must pass legal and other trademark searches to ensure that the names are available for use. As a result, it is possible that the favoured selection will not be the ultimate choice. The final decision will be made by the EMO Executive Director (“EMO(ED)”) in consultation with the PMC.
The process is described in greater detail below.
Nominations
Names can be nominated by anyone in the community via this GitHub Issue record.
Nominations will be open from November 15 until November 30, 2017 (UPDATED; note that the date had been incorrectly specified as November, 2018)
Naming Guidelines
All suggested names must conform to the following:
- They must conform to Oracle’s trademark usage guidelines. Amongst other things this means that the name cannot start with the word “Java”.
- They must conform to the Eclipse Foundation trademark guidelines.
- They must not be obscene, sexist, racist, controversial, etc., and they must not be frivolous (e.g. we’re not going to choose Boaty McBoatface or the like.)
Any suggested names which fail to meet the above criteria will be rejected.
Name Selection Process
The process will be executed as follows:
- Members of the community will be invited to enter their nominations into the specified channel;
- At the end of the nomination period, the names suggested by the community will be reviewed by the PMC to identify those which meet the criteria specified in the by the naming guidelines (depending on response, the PMC may decide to further reduce the list to a manageable size);
- The PMC will then initiate a community vote using the CIVS system (which will produce an overall ranking of the choices); and
- The results of the vote will be delivered to the EMO(ED) who will engage in the required legal and other trademark searches to ensure that the names are available for use, and consult with the PMC to make the final decision.
Since we have no idea what sort of community response to expect, it is difficult to time box anything other than the initial nomination process. But this will be an open and transparent process, and we invite the community to engage in all aspects of it. There is a great deal of legal, marketing, and community thought that goes into selecting an industry brand, so it’s important that we get this right. This may take a little time.
Just to get the party started, I will suggest the following... Use "EE4J" for both the top-level project and the brand name.
Another candidate would be to follow the open standards naming convention and create the "Open EE" brand.
I think it would be nice EJE - Eclipse Java Enterprise, so it's close to the old Java EE name .
As it contains more APIs, MacroProfile
My personal thought is just EEJ, which also is JEE backwards. It could stand for Enterprise Extensions for Java, Eclipse Enterprise Java, or Eclipse Extensions for Java which is my preference.
@kwsutter +1 for Open EE. Would EE still mean Enterprise Edition, Eclipse Enterprise, or do you have something else in mind?
@kwsutter +1 for Open Enterprise Extensions for the Java Platform.
- Eclipse Java Open Extensions (Eclipse JOE) - Joe is a nice pun on Java.
- Eclipse Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse JOE).
- Eclipse for the Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse JOE).
- Eclipse Open Extensions for Java (Eclipse OEJ or OE4J).
- Eclipse Enterprise Extensions for Java (EEEJ or Eclipse EEJ) - basically a way to drop the 4, some in the community think it is too gimmicky.
- Eclipse Extensions for the Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse EJOE).
@kwsutter +1 Open EE. Another alternative could be - Open JEE for Open Java Enterprise Edition.
I also proposed Open EE before, so definitely +1 to @kwsutter for Open EE
+1 for Eclipse Java Open Extensions (Eclipse JOE)
If it was feasible I'd prefer OpenJEE over just OpenEE (no Java in it, so it could mean anything, .NET, Angular, and I don't think that's the idea) but I have doubts the term "Java Enterprise Edition" is acceptable because that is exactly what Oracle wants to protect. Maybe OpenEEJ could work.
IBM recently created OpenJ9 Of course it had long branding and use of the "J9" part (lost track of what the "9" stood for, but it existed long before Java 9) but something that feels along those lines could be beneficial.
-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.
Cappuccino - a smoother, frothier cup of Java ☕😊
First thing that came to mind was Enterprise Java (EJ).
We'd have Enterprise Java specs, Enterprise Java certifications, and Enterprise Java experts.
Of course Eclipse IoT already has a project "Kura" which in Serbian or Croatian also sounds like a part of the male anatomy.
-1 for "JOE", as Wayne mentioned, the name must not start with "Java".
-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.
-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.
There's always a meaning in some language ;) The well known term "DOM" for example has a not so clever meaning in Dutch... Probably best to focus on English and only refrain from it if it's really, really bad in some well known language.
-1 for anything with the name Eclipse as part because of the history of the Eclipse IDE. Personally, the IDE invokes loads of pain and frustration. I'm equally certain there are others like me who feel the same way about the name Eclipse and what it invokes.
I also side with just Enterprise Java. Simple and still conveys the needed meaning.
Eclipse OpenJEE (Eclipse Open Java Enterprise Edition)
Perhaps the name should highlight that we're primarily working on SERVER APIs?
Even though technically everything these days can be used for whatever, we can't hide the fact that Java EE is mostly used for server applications.
As alternative to Open EE, perhaps something like
- Open Server
- Open Server API
- Open Server APIs
- ...
+1 for Open Server API, nice to decouple from a more corporate angle but keep the infrastructure lilt
+1 to use EE4J for both the top-level project and the brand name.
+1 to Eclipse MacroProfile
We hope someday the specs from MicroProfile and current Java EE will come from the same place, so using Macro (or anything like that) would be nice to show that it contains all specs.
I actually it would be good to drop the word Enterprise from it, as that makes it appear the it can only be used by large corporations, like IBM or Oracle, when in fact it can be used by small teams or individuals as well.
Open EE4J seems pretty obvious to me. We got no probably trademarked terms in it and everybody knows what's meant.
@keilw I had the exact same thing in mind 'OpenJEE' but then I thought that might just end up being referred as JEE again.
Open EE4J seems pretty obvious to me. We got no probably trademarked terms in it and everybody knows what's meant.
What spoils even is this 4 in the name, is much more accepted in my opinion OpenEEJ or Open EE .
Eclipse Enterprise, shortened to EE
(thanks David Blevins)
Simply "EE" would be fine for me. "EE certified" is familiar.
Anything with the name "Eclipse" in it should be out. This name is suppose to be a vendor neutral name so that anyone, Apache, Red Hat, Payara or anyone else will be willing to carry the branding.
Just adding my thoughts .. we have the following options ideas that I support :
1- It should NOT contain Eclipse keyword. eclipse foundation will manage it but it doesnt mean to
take its name.
2- It contains Java related key word to indicate that its a java based APIs (key words like J or Java).
3- we can keep or remove EE and replace it with something else that give the impression
that this is a server side APIs mainly.
4- a funky name like 'capitano' or 'cappuccino' both related to JAVA (Coffee) and will be good at branding and marketing purposes.
5- Open key word is a good indicator for an open APIs, but its not a must anyway.
+1 for OpenJEE, as such naming is aligned with OpenJDK and JavaEE.
I'm afraid in a time of "serverless" anything with "Server" in its name does not work that well either
How about Jakarta Enterprise Edition? Or is Jakarta still owned by Apache?
Anything with the name "Eclipse" in it should be out. This name is suppose to be a vendor neutral name so that anyone, Apache, Red Hat, Payara or anyone else will be willing to carry the branding.
looking at this angle makes sense.
Open Enterprise Specs for Java (OpenESJ or OpenES4J)
Like in JSR-366 JavaEE 8 first page: Java™ Platform, Enterprise Edition
(Java EE) Specification, v8
I had few thoughts while reading this thread:
-
This is a name for the set of specifications, not the Eclipse implementation. Should it have "Eclipse" in the name? I would rather use the term "Eclipse" for the branding of the Eclipse implementation instead of also adding it to the specification branding.
-
I think having the term "Enterprise" in the name is unnecessarily asserting a use-case or an environment for the specifications. It might turn off new users and it might also make it more difficult to include specifications that are not clearly "Enterprise" in nature.
-
I think the name should be very general and should allow the inclusion of various specifications as long as they complement each other in some way. If there is a need later to be more specific about a use-case or an environment for a subset of the specifications maybe we can use the profiles approach to subset the specifications and use the general brand as part of the profile name.
Based on the above, a very general name could be OpenJava, OJ, etc.
The Eclipse implementations could be under "Eclipse OpenJava" ,, EclipseOJ, etc.
An Enterprise profile could be "Enterprise OpenJava" EnterpriseOJ, etc.
Eclipse is not a vendor. Red Hat, IBM, Oracle, SAP and other vendors use e.g. the IDE foundations for their concrete products
Unless it would still follow the JCP, there will be no need for an Eclipse implementation or RI, so again, Eclipse is not the vendor but would rather define APIs which vendors use.
Looks like someone is going to have fun in consolidating the suggestions and summarize those. Is there a way to have a list of names?
I am neither a lawyer, nor a branding expert. With regards to Eclipse JOE, I think the leading Eclipse part in the official name solves any branding objections Oracle might have. Informal use of simply JOE also solves the issue of the Eclipse part being in the name that many folks in the community do not appreciate while still falling within the realm of Eclipse Foundation guidelines.
Espresso
"Espresso" is strong coffee, a play on words for "Strong Java"
From the perspective of certification Apache and Eclipse are just as much vendors as RedHat, IBM or Oracle. Just because you are not charging money for support doesn't mean you are not vending software. If the word vendor is somehow offensive, then perhaps I should use the word implementer. Every implementer, including Eclipse, should be put on equal footing. Eclipse provides stewardship. It does not mean they should have a branding advantage for certification.
@smillidge @dblevins Aside from an existing Eclipse project or architecture like "E4" the idea doesn't sound so bad. Could be along the lines of Amazon EC2
@kjjaeger What certification? Right now "Java Certified..." is provided by Oracle alone. Or offered via some training and education partners. It is not even decided what kind of standardization if any would govern this in the future. Eclipse advertises training: https://www.eclipse.org/community/training/classes.php but it is done by its member companies. Whether they pay a special member fee for that, I don't know, but there is no certification or training by Eclipse Foundation itself on that.
I agree that the name should not have the term "Eclipse" in it. For better or for worse, the term "Eclipse" is strongly associated with the IDE. Users of other IDEs may get the impression that this is not for them.
When I refer to certification I mean certified implementations that pass the TCK tests, not training.
EJ for enterprise java
ZEE
From Zetta raising EE to the power of 10^21
Also easy to say and keeps the EE sound either pronounced literally ZEE or "ZEE E E" or "Zed E E" if you are British. Also slightly recursive for American speakers.
I'm afraid in a time of "serverless" anything with "Server" in its name does not work that well either
Ironically though, the "servers serving serverless" themselves have to be build with something. Just as eventually the "cloud" is not an actual cloud either where computing power just magically appears out of thin air ;)
JOSE - Java Open Standard Extensions
+1 for ZEE, nice potential logos
JOSE starts with Java again.
ZEE sounds even more weird than how Google got its name.
The brand name needs to be relatable to Java EE and trip easily off the tongue. My vote is for OpenEE. My 2nd favourite is OpenJEE but, while that looks good written down, its a tongue twister when spoken out load. Too many syllables.
I still kinda like Jaffa Enterprise Edition.
While I wouldn't personally vote for JOSE, anything that starts with J is still OK so long as it is never expanded and we state it is not actually an acronym.
Open Enterprise Specs for Java (OpenESJ or OpenES4J)
Like in JSR-366 JavaEE 8 first page: Java™ Platform, Enterprise Edition
(Java EE) Specification, v8
I like this one.
Outside of the common name we will all use on our daily lives, we need this name to reflect the product itself: The set of specifications that will govern the new Non-JavaSE Approved Java APIs.
I do agree with other commenters that we should try to drop the Enterprise label now that we can.
So, my proposal would segue from Silvio's, et al, as:
Full Standard Name: Open Extensions Specification for Java
Full Name with Versioning: Open Extensions Specification for Java #
(where # could align with the corresponding JDK version number, or follow our own versioning)
Abbreviations: OpenESJ, and OpenESJ#
I would also, however, agree that we could have (besides the more officious naming) some catchy codename to bandy around. Maybe go the way of the Eclipse IDE and Android, and follow an alphabetical naming scheme, following some coffee theme?
We could just make J stand for Jay and use a bird for a logo.
Project FenEEx or PhoenEEx (regenerates from ashes and associtated with SUN :))
(In Greek mythology, a phoenix is a long-lived bird that is cyclically regenerated or born again. Associated with the Sun, a phoenix obtains new life by arising from the ashes of its predecessor)
"JEE" is unlikely to work either. As the phrase "Enterprise Edition" is also a no-go, "EE" likely would have to stand for "Eclipse Enterprise" after all. Although some with a strong Apache background and sympathy have problems, you already got plenty of Apache projects implementing Eclipse "standards" or let's say APIs for the sake of clarity. Geronimo Config, Tamaya and a few others (forgot the name, but either in the IoT or Big Data space based on an Eclipse project)
The brand name needs to be something you can create a brand from i.e. logos, memorable etc. Otherwise go with the project name EE4J. I would suggest 1 noun or 1 noun and an adjective.
Why not "FenEE" or "FanEE", but of course from US to British or Australian cultures this again stands for different parts of the human body ;-)
SaphirEE or just Saphire, to find a more... Sellable.. Name.
I am not afraid of the Enterprise word in the name. The current reality is not that enterprise = heavy and expensive (and only for big companies) as it seemed years ago, but that it is sofisticated, consistent, safe and useful for sustainable professional systems.
Java EE is now used even by small companies, ten years ago they used Tomcat or Jetty but now there is Payara, still Glassfish, WildFly, Tomcat ... and maybe soon there will be more implementations because the quality of components is better and better (sources, API, documentation, examples, usability, compatibility).
I prefer Open JEE; I think it will always be taken as the synonym for Java EE somehow ... and personnel agencies still search for J2EE developers so this would not make so much mess, we all know who are they looking for.
Btw "Jéééé" is what czech people call when they are pleasantly surprised (f.e. when you give them some nice gift) ;)
@smillidge Aside from the Java logo (which is protected by Oracle) or Duke (which is not protected, in fact at least JNoSQL or Yasson also use it in the context of an Eclipse projects) there have not been real logos for the Java EE standard or Spec either. Glassfish would be the RI mascot/logo while Jersey and a few other sub-projects use logos of their own.
Thinking in terms of search engine (a.k.a google) JOE is quite bad, will be hard to find a "JOE Rest example". On the other hand "Open EE" already relates the searches to Java EE.
@smillidge I truly think we could come up with branding for any conceivable name we end up with. Even if we chose a dozen random letters strung together.
I'm more interested on choosing a name that will be useful for the brand, then assign it some catchy codename for any extra branding and presentation.
With so many other suggestions, let me throw in something I briefly used a long time ago for a few Java and EE-related frameworks like ORM before those got superseded by standards like JPA/Hibernate.
OdyssEE. Given the long journey Java Enterprise has taken so far and an even longer that lies ahead with the whole transition, I would consider it an interesting option.
@keilw JOSE starts with J not with JAVA. It is not JavaOSE but it is JOSE. Is this forbidden?
@dinolupo JOSE would not be forbidden, so long as the J meant something different to "Java" in the extended name (if JOSE is an acronym), or the name was just "JOSE", without further meanings.
EJA - Extended Java Api
Seja - Standard Extensions Java Api
At least a few people have been assuming that the name will contain "Eclipse". e.g. "Eclipse OpenEE".
If the community really wanted to include Eclipse in the name, that would be fine. However, since this is actually not a project name, there is no rule that it must contain Eclipse.
HTH
@smillidge ZEE might mean the news media channel NSE:ZEEMEDIA :)
I feel like not many people are reading those required docs about trademarks that were given in the original post.
Oracle won't allow us to use the word Java, unless we specify our product has no direct relation to Oracle's product.
Even then, we must follow some guidelines to show the difference.
For example, with the Java trademark, we couldn't use the word Java by itself, or at the start of a product name, or even at the end.
We need to specify our product (the specs) are related to Java, or for use with Java, or to add things to Java, but we cannot identify them as being part of Java.
And then, if we get permission from Oracle to use it that way, any header or logo with our product name must have the tagline (that has Java in it) in a smaller font size, different font type, and/or different colors (except red, which is a big no no).
So, if we are going to use the Java name, we are under the obligation of using some tagline, like:
for Java/Oracle Java
for use with Java/Oracle Java
extending Java/Oracle Java
etc.
@ccristian I would refine that to FEENX pronounced Phoenix. Would be a good name for branding and imagery also contains the EE in there.
Open Enterprise, or LibrEE = free in Spanish
Why not to have EE ? Iam still proud to have on my CV J2EE and Java EE.Thanks to this technology I fed my family for years like hundreds of tousands of others.
Open Enterprise Edition - OpenEE
@YoshiEnVerde you can't brand any number of random characters. It has to be pronounceable and memorable. People need to want to wear the t-shirts and get the stickers. We are discussing a brand for EE4J. We have a descriptive project name EE4J.
EJA - Extended Java Api
Seja - Standard Extensions Java Api
here in Brazil this name is used to: Youth and Adult Education (EJA)
Sunrise. I think it's a nice name, with a positive connotation. Referring to the new era Java EE is going into. Also it provides a nice little pun to Eclipse, which in the end was of course a play on Sun. Eclipse Sunrise :)
Eclipse Open Java Enterprise - Eclipse OpenJE. I think the name "edition" is unnecessary, because the name "Eclipse Open Java Enterprise" already explains your purpose.
@smillidge thats a good one FEENX ! Has the meaning of the rebranding the history in it (sun reborn ..)
Eclipse JxEE (EJxEE)
--> Eclipse because it can not start with Java
--> JxEE because obvious play on J2EE
Eclipse SundaEE
--> Java is one of the Sunda Islands
--> Anything starting with Sun would be a fun turn of events
--> Everyone loves Ice-Cream ;)
Eclipse JaxEnter ;-)
--> Short for Eclipse Java x Enterprise Edition
--> If I could only get my head around where I heard this word before... coughs
We are discussing a brand for EE4J. We have a descriptive project name EE4J.
No we are not.
Please read the OP closely. We are discussing a brand for the specs.
EE4J is the name of the project that will produce implementations for these specs we're branding here.
It's not the same.
As stated in the OP, we're trying to find the equivalent of Java EE and Java SE, when EE4J is the equivalent of OpenJDK.
And I was pretty sure my comment on a dozen random letters was perfectly understandable as a ridiculous case. I was just illustrating that, besides the catchy brand name, we actually need a USEFUL brand name.
So to be clear, Java cannot be used at the beginning but can be used at the middle or end of a name? Oracle's trademark rules seem a bit arbitrary on that.
@kjjaeger It's not exactly as clear cut. Oracle's trademark rules forbid Java (and any other Oracle trademark) from being used in any way that would tie the product to the trademark in a way that doesn't make it clear the product is not part of the trademark itself.
For example, you cannot use Java at the end of the name either.
Eclipse EE is a good name, because Java cannot be used, but Java EE is very popular. Then the people will link Eclipse EE with Java EE.
Other good name is Eclipse Open Enterprise Application Eclipse OpenEA or Eclipse OEA. I prefer Eclipse OpenEA.
How about eJava? The e could be for eclipse or enterprise ... or enigma for that matter. This would simple, recognizable and the meaning is understood.
Eclipse OpenEE
Is it MicroProfile, Eclipse MicroProfile, or are those two separate things? My reading of Eclipse documents seems to indicate those are in fact distinct from each other. MicroProfile being the standard and Eclipse MicroProfile being the project and reference code. Shouldn't there be some consistency in the naming? I notice IBM, Payara and others never say Eclipse MicroProfile. They just use MicroProfile. Just an observation.
JEE which of course stands for "JEE Enterprise Edition". That is in no conflict with the previous name which was officially JavaEE. It also does not contain Java. It would make the transition smooth as many people already (wrongly) used JEE to refer to JavaEE.
@kjjaeger @Daniel-Dos AFAIK MicroProfile was launched at JavaOne 2016 by IBM and few others, and later it was moved under Eclipse and so became Eclipse MicroProfile. So now both should mean the same -https://developer.ibm.com/wasdev/blog/2016/10/26/what-is-microprofile/
@manikmagar Perhaps they are suppose to be equivalent, but I notice a preference by many to steer clear of the Eclipse name and just use MicroProfile. Perhaps for simplicity, or perhaps because they don't feel like promoting the Eclipse Foundation in their products.
+1 for Open Enterprise Extensions for Java (OEEJ).
-1 for any "Eclipse" in the name. Should be a name without other brands, and Eclipse is a very knowladge brand. For me, to put "Eclipse" in the name will cause confusion.
After reading all the comments here there are 2 things that I feel should not be in the name that is "Eclipse" and "Enterprise". Basically these are a bunch of API/SPI that support common use cases people have to solve when building applications, with that in mind my suggestions are;
- Open API Extensions for Java (OAEJ)
- Open API Extensions for Java Applications (OAEJA)
JEESUS how many options we have :)